Aug 09, 2013 5:11 PM

Pierre, Chad and David Johansen, on the significance of the BIRTH CERTIFICATE being LAMINATED and/or NOT LAMINATED- thread.....

Pete Daoust: Why if I plastify the birth certificate, it becomes no more valid ?

same reason as if I plastify a $20 Bank Note I guess...

Same thing with a freaking CHECK

David Johansen: because it CANT be cancelled... you cant endorse a cheque if it's plastic encased, you could remove that and claim it was never endorsed.

David Johansen: laminated with 2" wide clear packing tape!, we do that sometimes with the wide 4" rolls, as a laminate for a soc sec card or other thing they say not to! ..|., them.

Pete Daoust: So they are ASSUMING that, one day, someone will INdorse the birth certificate ??

Pete Daoust: So they don't want me to laminate it for that reason ?

David Johansen: the other reason would be the raised seal. you cant feel a raised seal through a lamination.

Chad Brodgesell: I think in the end to make simple of it is if you laminate the B.C. then you have altered it. The plastic is melted in to the fibers of the bond paper there by altering it. Putting it in a plastic sleeve is better. The question of laminating documents has come up a lot. If the issuers of said document did not issue it laminated (such as the D.L.) then it should not be ALTERED.

Pete Daoust: OK Chad Brodgesell, we ALL know that if we laminate the BC with plastic film, it will be altered....the question was: WHY is it we can NOT do it, why is it we can NOT alter it...

Chad Brodgesell: YOU CAN NOT FUCKING ALTER THE SAID DOCUMENT BECAUSE YOU DO NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO DO SO.

Pete Daoust: The answer would be more like: NO! there are detailed security features on a birth certificate that is not originally laminated. If you laminate/tape etc it will NOT be accepted. So I don't see anything related to AUTHORITY in this, the security features seems to be the reason, like laminating a $10 bill would make the same effect.....That is the MOST valuable answer I've find so far....

Chad Brodgesell: Security features. Mmmmmm.. So if you laminated it these features would not be able to be inspected properly. SO IF YOU FUCKING LAMINATED IT THAT WOULD """ALTER""" THE THING TO THE POINT WHEN THOSE SECURITY FEATURES WOULD NOT BE ACCESSIBLE. Plus, you DO NOT have the AUTHORITY to alter the document.

Derek Moran: My BC is laminated. I, nor my family did it. Went to ServiceOntario to ask questions regarding it. The girl at the counter automatically gave me shit for it when she saw it was laminated. After i went- "AHEM," she took a look at the date of it and went- "OH, well...we stopped doing that SINCE then." She did tell me that one of the numbers on it, was a- "tracking number." The number she was referring to, was the CUSIP number...

Chad Brodgesell: Yes those are the results of ALTERING without the authority too. Forgery is not altering a document, it is creating a new one without the authority to do so.

Who-are You Frisbey: well sure they can laminate it it's theirs it's their property they made it they can do with it what they want

Chad Brodgesell: The act of altering or creating something CREATES the offence of forgery and/or counterfeiting...when you do not have the authority to do so

Who-are You Frisbey: they also have to prove intent

Chad Brodgesell: If you do not have the authority to alter and/or create something but you go ahead and do it then by one or more of those actions you have committed the offence of forgery and/or counterfeiting. Whether you get caught and/or convicted is a different story.

Chad Brodgesell: Pete Daoust do you have the authority to create a B.C.? A Canadian Bank Note? A D.L.? No you do not. So if you alter or create those then you have committed a crime. Do you comprehend that?

Pete Daoust: So if you alter or create those then you have committed a crime: And who will be the injured partie.. ?

If I laminate a BC, it is a crime ?, if I cut a $20 in 4, it is a crime ?

Chad Brodgesell: Yes Pete Daoust , "If you do not have the authority" think about that. That would only apply to something within the jurisdiction of the authority in the first place.

Pete Daoust: Sorry....it dosen't make sense when you bring this authority thing in the picture....where have you got that information ?....common sense ?...I just can't get it, and I will prove you this, I will get my BC out as we speak, I will write FUCK YOU on it, and I garanty you that NOTHING will happen, I will use one of the 20 certified copy if I need it in the future...

I can do the same with a $20 bill I also have in my pocket

Who-are You Frisbey: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ownership

Daniel J Wentz: I've known Scott Duncan, a very long time.

All of this will be used against you later on. That's the only reason he doesn't just ban you. I've had my finger poised on the button myself.

You may have figured this out by now, but Scott is a lot smarter than any of you. Everything he does is with a reason. I suspect someone is going to be a teaching aid and/or object lesson. I could be wrong, but I've seen this all before.